Bob Burg - Making A Significant Impact The Go-Giver Way™

Kelley Skar 0:14

Welcome to the SUCCESS™ Coaching Podcast. I'm your co host Kelley Skar and with me as always Mr. Ben Fairfield and Mr. Todd Foster and today we have a very special guest, Mr. Bob Burg is in the house joining us in our conversation. But before we jump into these questions that we're going to be peppering him with, let's jump into his bio first and then we'll get into the conversation. For over 30 years Bob Burg has been successfully showing entrepreneurs leaders sales professionals how to communicate their value and accelerate their referral business. Although for years, he was best known for his sales classic, endless referrals. It's his business parable, The Go-Giver, co authored with John David Mann that has created a worldwide movement. While part of a four book series, The Go-Giver itself has sold more than 1 million copies and has been translated into 30 languages. It was rated number 10 on Inc Magazine's list of most motivational books ever written and was Hubspot's 20 most highly rated sales books of all time. Welcome to the show, my friend.

Bob Burg 1:07

Thank you, great to be with all of you.

Ben Fairfield2:09

There's a few of us, Bob, it's awesome to see you. And your name came up right out of the gates when we were talking about initial guests if we wanted to have on and so we're honored that you took time out of your schedule to be here with us. And I know, we're all going to learn a lot. And we're going to get to know the real Bob Burg at a different level than I think a lot of people do. So I think we'll just kick it off there. So your book, The Go-Giver, and Todd can attest to this. We worked together with the company we came from previously, we read it as an entire organization. So I'm not just saying I like it, because you're on I would tell you I didn't like it. That's just who I am. I actually like the book. And I think everyone really should get a copy and should read it because it really speaks to the heart of where I believe business should already be and where it needs to be if it's not yet especially in these uneasy times and the changing landscapes. But you know, that's probably what I would say you're best known for. We kind of want to go back in time. So let's hop in the Time Machine and go back. You know, not infant status, but like back in the day.

Bob Burg 2:10

Yeah, I was gonna say should I say I was born at a very young age or something.

Ben Fairfield 2:15

When you were starting down the path that ultimately led you there, tell us about the early days and kind of who Bob was and kind of what got you on the path that inevitably brought you to where you are today?

Bob Burg 2:26

Yeah, well, so I began in broadcasting. I was a radio sports guy. And then I got a job in television news at a very small ABC network affiliate in the Midwest. I worked my way up to the late night news guy, but I really wasn't very good. And so I mean, I could read the news. I think anybody could probably do that. But I certainly wasn't a journalist. And it wasn't long before I I like to say I graduated into sales. Okay. Now the challenge was, I had never had any formal sales training. And the company where I was working, will just say their sales training was negligible at best, meaning non-existent, so I was kind of on my own. So I, you know, knocked on doors and made calls and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, on top, and I got nowhere. I was what Jim Rohn would call what he would have said, I had the motivation, but I didn't have the information. Right. And you need both because you can have the information and not the motivation. You're also not going to get anywhere but I had, I had no information. So I floundered for a few months. One day I was in a bookstore. And I was looking for something I didn't know what now this is 40 years ago. So it's not as though sales books and those were really well known. It wasn't, you know, they're everywhere. Today, back then that wasn't really the case. But I saw a couple of books, one was by Tom Hopkins, and one was by Zig Ziglar, two of our icons and the, you know, the sales in personal development field, and I got their books. And I gotta tell you first just the titles of the books, knowing that there was a methodology for sales, a system, a way of doing something that was encouraging to me. So I study I'd get home from work, and I would just study those books, I would, I would read, I would highlight, I would underline, I would rehearse and I mean, into the wee hours of the morning, within a few weeks, my sales began to go through the rough. Now there was really nothing different about me. Other than now, three weeks later, I had a system.

Now personally, and I'm not saying my definition is necessarily the correct one, but it's the one I've that I believe I define a system as simply the process of predictably achieving a goal based on a logical and specific set of how to principles. The key being predictability. If it's been proven that by doing A you'll get you can get the desired results of B, then you know, all you need to do is A and B You need to do A and continue to do A, and eventually you'll get the desired results of B. And so that's what I did. But there was something even better that I began to realize that part of understanding and learning sales was diving into personal development. I didn't know about any of this stuff. So I'm getting Og Mandino's Greatest Salesman in the World and Carnegie's How to Win Friends and Influence People and, and Hill's Think and Grow Rich, and, you know, as A Man Thinketh and, and Maxwell Maltz's, Psycho Cybernetics, and my world is opening. Whoa, right. I mean, I'm a guy who I barely graduated high school. In fact, on graduation day, my guidance counselor saw me as I was walking off the field, and he said, Burg, I can't believe you actually made it. And here's the thing, he was a nice guy. I mean, he wasn't one of these people who tried to hurt anybody. But he was right. Okay. And then I got into college on academic probation, which is no big deal. But I graduated on academic probation. This doesn't happen. So here's a guy who wanted nothing to do with learning and all of a sudden, you know, learning and seeing a different world. And I began to realize that success is an inside job, right? It begins here. It now it manifests outwardly. But it begins in here. So I'm really, you know, just I love sales, and I love it. Now, I was going, you know, I was doing well, a couple years later, I joined a different company. And it was a high ticket item. And I got off to a slow start. And I was really in a slump. And I made a mistake that many young sales people make when they're in a slump. Rather than putting even more focus on pleasing the customer and how I could do that. I began to panic. And it was all about me, and all about making the sale. And as you know, the more you focus on yourself, the the the worse it is. And I was very lucky, because there was a gentleman where I worked. He was an older guy. He wasn't even in the sales department. He was I think he was an engineer or something. And I think he was getting ready to retire because I don't remember even seeing him after that. I didn't know him very well. But he was one of these people who, and I know all three of you and everyone listening, watching. We've all met these people. He didn't say much. But whenever he did say something, it was always profound. And I think he saw me as sort of like Joe in The Go-Giver who I would write about 25 years later with with John David Mann, right. He saw me as that young, ambitious, up and coming hard working really after a guy who was also very, very frustrated, and his focus was totally in the wrong place. And he said to me, Burg, he was a last name kind of guy. He said, Burg, can I gave you some advice. I said, Absolutely, please do I need it. He said, If you want to make a lot of money in sales, he said, don't have making money as your target. Your target is serving others. Now, when you hit the target, he said, you'll get a reward. And that reward will come in the form of sale of money. And you can do with that money, whatever you choose. But never forget the money is simply the reward for hitting the target. It ain't the target itself. Your target is serving others. And I think that's where it really hit me. That great salesmanship is never about the salesperson. Great salesmanship is never about the product or service. As important as that is it's just it's not what it's about. Great salesmanship is about the other person. It's about that person whose life you are trying to add value to really, it's about another person's life being better just because you are part of it. And I think that when we approach sales from that foundational premise, I really think we're nine steps ahead of the game in a 10 step game.

Ben Fairfield 9:38

That's massive like drop the mic right there I think this is this we're done with the podcast now like you know honestly like let's let's unpack that for like wow, like, I could not agree more I know these these guys agree. That's why they're here in a part of this with me because we have the same philosophy on sales at And I think that this is so critical because so many people get get lost in feature selling, they get so tied up in in selling the widget that they have to sell, they forget or lose in that process the the focus on the fact that there's a consumer on the other end, and that as long as we genuinely care about that person, we have an understanding of what their needs are. And we can come alongside that and help answer the questions they have reduced the fear that they they're feeling and solve the problem that they're experiencing. You don't have to be a sales salesy salesperson, if you will, you just need to be the guy that that understands, or the gal that understands what it is, your target market wants, who they are, and then just being as many conversations and relationships with those people as you can, like Todd, Kelley, what are your thoughts like, this is big for everyone listening, regardless of industry?

Todd Foster11:05

I agree with you completely Ben, and I was actually going and I've thought about this many times, while reading all The Go-Giver books, are there any characters in that book that are very relatable to you, and any characters in the book that are completely opposite of who you are?

Bob Burg 11:19

Well, the, you know, the the main character, Joe, he was he was named Joe, because of the you know, the the saying the average Joe, because I think we've all been Joe or Josephine, you know, we've, we've all been at that place where we were just starting out. And we may have had potential. And we, you know, we really wanted to bring value to others. We believe in our product or service. And we were out there and we were really working at it and just so frustrated that it wasn't happening. And there was probably something we were doing that it was probably the focus, it was probably being just so into the product or service itself thinking everybody else should be to it. Yeah. And, and so that was Joe, that he was written as the you know, as the average Joe. Now there was there was Pindar, who was, you know, the main mentor, and and John David Mann and I, we say we loosely based him upon Bob Proctor. If you know, Bob Proctor from Toronto, Bob is just this great guy. We pictured Pindar looking like him, he had that he has that elegant kind of you know, in a deep voice, and he's very much a prosperity thinker. And he'll help anyone and he's just a hugely successful guy. And, and so we kind of, we kind of look toward Bob, we picture that voice, you know, of Panda, then there were others who were sort of compendiums of different people. Now I related most to Gus, because he was the connector in the story. And that's, you know, that's kind of my strength. I'm, I'm, I was probably put on earth to be an encourager, but God that, you know, that's kind of how I think of myself and a connector, and somebody who's looking or, you know, always looking for ways to, you know, to put people together and do that. But, you know, I think all the different characters, a couple of which were just totally made up, and others that were kind of based on people. And now within the story, too, they were a lighting, it's a parable. So it's a bit of work of fiction, but there were many stories in there, events that happened to the co authors, and we just worked them into the story. So So that's kind of how we did that with the, with the characters. So yeah, I mean, they were all relatable, because I think we've all had the experience of meeting those kinds of people or being one of those kinds of people.

Kelley Skar 13:49

So I love that I love the fact that you consider yourself a connector because I feel exactly the same way that's that's kind of how I love being able to put people together without expectation of anything coming as a result of it, right? It's, if if somebody's got a problem, and I can help fill a need and somebody else can help fold and solve that problem. I'm there to connect those people those two people together, which I think is a phenomenal way to live your life. My question for you would be Bob, if you were coaching me and I was stuck kind of where Joe was stuck, you know, I was stuck on myself and not really looking at the the customer, the client in you know, the fashion that, you know, the parable actually follows How would you coach me to get my mindset shifted from, you know, self absorbed and, you know, egocentric to one that that you're you're more selfless and and, you know giving and providing value. And you know, kind of picture I guess the hard thing for Joe is to see that this type of sales actually works right. But it takes time and effort and work so I'm curious how you would coach someone like that.

Bob Burg 14:56

So the good thing about Joe was that he was coachable. You know, he really wanted to learn and yeah, he had some doubts, but you remember Pindar's one condition right? That he had to apply every law that very day before he went to bed that night. Because it's not just a matter of thinking about it, it's a matter of doing it. That's why we say we like people to be both go getters, people of action, and go givers. People who are absolutely laser focused on providing immense value to others. So be a go getter and a go giver Just don't be a go taker, right. And so Joe, at the beginning of the story, he was a go getter, but he was also kind of a go taker. That was his focus. But of course, he switched, he became a state of go -getter, a person of action, but he became a go giver. So that was Joe. Joe was teachable. He was coachable. But as you said, what about the person who'd they just don't get? Why something? Yeah, it kind of goes like this. Yeah, this Go-Giver stuff. Are you focusing on the other person instead of myself? Yeah, I get that. And I'll do that once I have the money. But right now, I really need the money, that's got to be my focus. Well, so what I would ask the person is, would you be willing to go through kind of a thought experiment? And just kind of see how it works out? And they probably say, Yeah, sure. So I'd say, let's say you're the prospect. And I'm the salesperson. And I really need the money. Okay, so my focus is going to be on myself, and it's really going to be getting the money from you into my bank account. That's kind of where I am. So we mean, I'm going to do the presentation. And, you know, we started out, I asked you questions, because I've been taught to do that. But as you answer, I'm not fully listening in order to truly understand, I'm really listening more to see how I can kind of use that information to sharp angle you into a close when I I'm kind of talking benefits and why this is for you before I truly know what it is you're looking to accomplish. Because again, you know, you know, I need the money here, I need to focus on just getting the money when you have an objection. I'm a little defensive about it. Because you know, I mean, I'm using the standard, you know, answer. I'm not really digging deep into discovering what the true objection is, I'm just giving what I've been trained to do, because, again, your objection standing in the way of my money. Okay, and I'm closing too often, and then too hard. Now, my question to you would be, are you at this point, based on this more likely or less likely to want to buy from me right now. And the chances are, it would be less likely because you really don't have the confidence and the faith and the trust in me, knowing that I'm looking out for your best interest. And the person would probably say, Yeah, that's right. So now, let's try this on the same salesperson. And I still need the money, okay, but here's what I'm going to do. I'm not going to deny myself interest, because I am. So I'm a human being as human beings, actually, we are all self interested. That's how our ancestors were able to move their genes to the next generation through that self interest. So that's part of it, okay? Now, I'm not going to deny my self interest. But what I'm going to do is, I'm going to temporarily suspend my self interest, I'm going to put it off to the side. And when I go in there, and we meet, I'm going to ask you questions. And I'm going to listen. And I'm really going to listen and try to absorb and really get where you are coming from. I'm going to also realize that because as human beings, we all see the world from our own set of beliefs, that what you say what I think I understand might not really be what you meant. So I'm going to tactfully and diplomatically, keep on sort of digging deep, until I really know that what you need, what you want, what you desire, and the only one I'm positive about that, am I going to even begin to connect the benefits of my product or service with what you need want and desire. When you have an objection, I'm going to welcome it. And I'm going to congratulate you and I'm going to suggest that it's very important because in order for us to to move forward and to be able to help you with this, you need to be comfortable with this. And what I'm going to do is not just answer the the objection that's given, I'm going to work within the context of this objection with this person so we can get to the root of it, the heart of it, and then together, we're going to work through that objection and advance the process. By the time we get to the point where I'm ready to ask for the order, okay, I'm going to simply ask you to take action on something you've already told me. You want to do it. Now, I'll ask you are you more likely or less likely to want to do business with me to buy from me right now. And the chances are probably more likely. So not only is having a focus on that person, there's nothing self sacrificial about it. There's nothing martyr-ish about it. Okay? Now it's the it's the most profitable way of doing business. It also happens to be the way that feels best. Why do I say it's the most profitable? Because remember, and I think this is, so and I say this at practically every conference, when I speak to salespeople, and that's this, nobody is going to buy from you. Because you have a quota to meet. Okay, they're not going to buy from you because you need the money or because you want a sales award on the the office wall, they're going to buy from you because they believe that they will be better off by doing so than by not doing so. And then the basically free market economy in which we all do business free markets simply mean no one's forced to do business with anyone else, okay, they're only going to do business for that reason. And that's the only reason why they they should. The good news about that is that that salesperson or entrepreneur, who really can take themselves out of the equation here, and focus simply on bringing that person what they want, need and desire. That's the person who creates that benevolent context for success. Pardon the pun. It's also why John David Mann and I say that money is simply an echo of value.

Voiceover 22:00

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Todd Foster 22:12

So going back to your, I guess, before, the person we know is Bob Burg, today.Who were you before you even started the entire broadcasting career and I had to decide to go to college for broadcasting. What was the Bob Burg like, like around 12 or so?

Bob Burg 22:31

The Bob Burg that's 12 wanted to be the third baseman for the Boston Red Sox could have been had it been for one thing, a total lack of talent. But I was also you know, I was very fortunate to have great parents and a wonderful family. But I had I, you know, I had and still have, it's always something I have, and will have his OCD, obsessive compulsive disorder, which is a very debilitating kind of mental illness. And so it's something I've had to live with, and so forth. So that's been a, you know, a tough thing for me. So it caused me a lot of anger, anger at myself, anger at the world, that was something I certainly didn't understand until I was a little older and got diagnosed. Again, this is a while ago, back then it's not like they knew about this. And it wasn't, I was much older, so So I had a lot of anger inside me. And that anger really manifested in many ways until I was about probably 35, and had attained a certain amount of success. And yet I knew that, in order for me to really step it up and take it to the next level, I was going to have to make some major changes in my life. It was at about that time that a guy named Charlie Tremendous Jones. And I don't know if you remember Charlie, I think you three are a little too young to remember him, but to know who he is. But he was one of the big back in the days with, you know, when, when zig and and, you know, Og Mandino and, and all these, you know, the icons were doing the major circuits back then there actually were circuits. I mean, they were at the the major, you know, apparently was one of the one of the big ones he wrote the book life is tremendous, and a number of other other classics. But Charlie who really turned out to be a mentor of mine and just a wonderful human being. Charlie sent me a book, the autobiography of Ben Franklin, which is a book I would recommend to anyone and everyone. And there was one chapter in particular that was life changing for me. And that's where Ben explains that he realized that he had certain characteristics that were really hurting his chances of advancement and he was an ambitious guy. And he knew there were things he had to work on, if he was to be able to realize his potential. Now, back then, you know, you didn't have personal development courses, right. And so he was an inventor he did on his own. And what he did is he took 13 traits that he felt he needed to work on weaknesses that he needed to turn into strengths. And he would take one and work on one for an entire week. And he would just keep that totally front of mind in consciousness, he would just work on that particular trade, he take his yellow sticky note, and I'm only kidding, there were no yellow sticky notes back there, he would do whatever he did, he reminded himself and, and, and then he do that for one whole week. Okay, now he'd move on to trait number two and do the same thing for that particular trait. Then trait number three, trait number four, he does this all 13 weeks now, there are 13 weeks, there are 52 weeks in a year. 13 times four are 52. So he would go back and repeat the first week and run through it again. So in the course of a year, he could go through his program four times. And at the end of that year, he either totally lit those negative traits, or came really close. Well, I did the same thing. I just again, I follow systems, right, the process of predictably achieving a goal based on a logical and specific set of how to principles. It was good enough for Ben, it was good enough for me. And so I took a few of the same traits of bands that were similar to mine. But there were others that were more specific to me. And I went through that course. And it absolutely changed my life. And that was really the beginning for all the books I had written before that when I first got in sales, and all the work I had done and all that it was great. But I was still stuck in my old ways of anger and internal hatred. And many of the things that were very counterproductive that you know, if I did not turn into, you know, from weaknesses into strengths. See, I believe there are three types of weaknesses because, you know, we always hear focus on your strengths. By the way, I think that's great advice. Absolutely, of course, focus on your strengths. If you didn't hire out people to do what you did, of course, I think there were three types of weaknesses that we have. The first one is the type of weakness we can ignore, because it really doesn't make a difference. Uh, the generic example, for me would be I am not good at running long distances, that is a weakness of mine. Now, since I'm 63, and have absolutely no plans to run a marathon, that is a weakness I totally ignore. Then there were weaknesses we need to mitigate. Those are the ones we don't necessarily have to turn them into total strengths. But we need to watch them and make now on one hand on a personal level, you know, I love junk food, and don't like working out that could be a very dangerous combination. So about 12-13 years ago, I hired a personal trainer. She comes in, excuse me, used to be six days a week now it's five days a week, she works me out every morning and prepares my healthy meals for the day. And I've kind of created an environment around me where it keeps me relatively healthy. Okay, I don't go crazy with it. Okay. But I don't and I also, you know, I don't keep Oreo cookies in the house. Right? Because if I did, they would be gone. Not one or two of them. Not one sleeve of them. They would be gone. Yeah. Okay. So I mean, I put myself in a position where I can mitigate the weakness. Then there are the weaknesses, we need to turn into strengths. These are the ones that if we don't do something about we can simply never be as effective as we could be. A couple of mine that I worked on, were more of my anger issue, a lack of gratitude that I had, I was also a gossiper. I spoke negatively about people I listened to. Money management was another weakness of mine. And, you know, there were others. And when I worked on those, and the improvement that made in my life, you know, I'm so forever grateful to Charlie Tremendous Jones for forgiving me that that book by Ben Franklin.

Ben Fairfield 29:27

That's so awesome. Now, okay, so you went on a pretty sounds like remarkable personal growth journey, and kind of developed into who we see in front of us today. And I think I speak for everyone I'm grateful that you did because we're grateful for the books that you've written. So what what led you as we're kind of we're coming to the end of our time here What led you to writing books like how did how did you go from from that personal journey growth to writing the endless referrals book and then ultimately writing the go giver in the subsequent writings from that like, what what was that bridge? What got you there?

Bob Burg 30:06

So eventually, after I while I was still in sales, I eventually worked my way up to sales manager with a company. Really enjoyed teaching sales as well as doing it. I love going out, you know, when the the salespeople would do their presentations, I'd go with them and I was able to, and I'd have them come in watch me and, and I started teaching you know really how to do these things and other people started to ask me to, you know, teach them and I thought I could maybe, you know, in this is the short story, the dot dot dot you know to the thing because there were things in between that that but eventually I began a speaking business and in about my gosh, maybe third, fourth fifth year, I was at a National Speakers Association convention and a couple of the more veteran speakers just said to me, it was time for me to write a book because you know, it would help market me better make me it would make me more marketable, higher fees, better position, the authority and so forth, which turned out to be a great idea. And that was my book, endless referrals network your everyday contacts into sales, which is my first kind of big book that and so that one I wrote for totally utilitarian purposes, I use it as a marketing tool. All of my books after that whether I co-authored the series of four go giver books with John David Mann is a remarkable writer. You know, he's really the lead writer and storyteller in The Go-Giver books, and he's a Java how, you know, he can tell from talking to me for two minutes, I'm a how to person, right? I'm pretty boring. John's a great storyteller. So whether it's the series or other books that I wrote before that or after that, that I single singly authored instead of co authored. A, those are because I felt I had something I wanted to say. And I felt a book was the best medium to express those views and thoughts and so forth. So that's really how those you know, those those came about.

Todd Foster 32:07

You were talking about the OCD being a weakness, do you also believe the OCD may have been a strength for you as well, on your journey?

Bob Burg 32:15

Yeah, that's a that's a great question. So there's nothing good about OCD, okay. OCD is not the same as being obsessive about something, you know, when people say, Oh, I'm so OCD about this, it's a totally different thing. And it really annoys people who have OCD when we do that. But we realize people don't know, you know, that's okay. And I don't really want them to know, because it's such a horrible thing to have to, you know, to have to have. But it's a chemical disorder in the brain. And so there's, it's very distressful. And there's nothing one does not succeed, see, if one is obsessive about something or some things, one succeeds, to a certain point because of that obsession, you know, that magnificent obsession, right? That's not what this is. One does not succeed, because of having OCD. they succeed, despite having OCD. That said, I'll say this one thing, if there's anything that OCD having OCD gave me, that is actually a strength. It's having a really well developed sense of empathy for others. I mean, I can really understand someone's distress. It doesn't have to be about OCD or anything. And I think that does. Now if you said to me, Well, Bob, you know, with all that said, if you had the choice going back, and you know, how much, you know, empathy, you could have OCD and so forth, would you would you choose to have it? And the politically correct answer would be yes, but absolutely not. I'd rather be a little less deep, a little less empathetic, and not have not ever had OCD. But as long as it's something that I did have, for whatever reason I was supposed to have it, you know, I hope I can use it as a way to, you know, to somehow help the world and I know that and this is not usually something I end up talking about a lot. But if I'm asked, you know, and I was asked certain, you know, questions about my youth and everything and, and what shaped me and so forth, I will talk about it. And invariably there are people who will, you know, reach out to me and say that they think maybe their child or someone they know or whatever. So I'll take this opportunity to just say there is help from the OCD Foundation which is located in Boston, they just do an absolutely wonderful job. They have fantastic resources, IOCDF.org is their website, and if anyone does, you know feel as though they have a loved one or someone they feel might have OCD, and hopefully they don't, but it might be a good thing to check anyway. I would suggest reaching out and getting in touch with them.

Voiceover 35:06

It's time for the lightning round.

Ben Fairfield 35:13

So Bob, we're At the end of our time, and we'd like to wrap this by asking three short questions just to get your initial response on these. These are called our lightning round questions. They have nothing to do with anyone specific. They're just fun to see your response. So here's the first one. What's the biggest lie you once believed was true?

Bob Burg 35:34

This is not an easy question. What's the biggest lie that the Red Sox would never actually win a World Series?

Ben Fairfield 35:50

Well, I'm glad that that was that was proven to be a lie for you because you sound like a great fan there. Here's the next one. What do you want to be remembered for when you're gone?

Bob Burg 36:02

That as an encourager that I that I made people feel genuinely good about themselves.

Ben Fairfield 36:09

Love that. All right. And last one. You could trade places with anyone for a day, who would it be?

Bob Burg 36:17

Oh, with anyone for a day? Wow. Wow. Wow. Wow. I think you've stumped me. I really can't. I mean, I can think of people I'd want to hang out with for a day, you know, but I can't think of anybody necessarily. I'd want to and by the way, as much as I did love the Red Sox. I am a Miami Marlins fan. I've lived in Florida for 30 years now and I totally am a Miami Marlins fan.

Ben Fairfield 36:43

The truth comes out. All right, Bob. Well, I just want to say thank you on behalf of Todd and Kelley and all of us here at success coaching for taking time out of your day. I know you've had an impact on all of our lives and you will continue to want it to be an encourager is what you said and my friend, you've definitely been that and continue to be that and we're just grateful for you being here.

Bob Burg 37:07

I appreciate you all very much. Thank you for having me.